tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1632277302970738748.post3227797957871484912..comments2024-02-01T08:25:47.678-08:00Comments on Now and Not Yet: Why I'll Still #BeUMC part 3 - Spirit vs. LetterDavid Livingstonhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16824538078808156089noreply@blogger.comBlogger4125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1632277302970738748.post-48232344207927768082022-02-13T13:54:50.713-08:002022-02-13T13:54:50.713-08:00I don't know much about the Michigan conferenc...I don't know much about the Michigan conference. What's the breakdown of your clergy? The AC structure gives clergy much more representation than laity- which is one of the frustrations often voiced by traditionalists, who feel our clergy have been biased by 'liberal' seminaries.Josephhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05879094201619427418noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1632277302970738748.post-57411330302240477142021-10-30T21:06:59.099-07:002021-10-30T21:06:59.099-07:00I missed this comment. To clarify, I'm talking...I missed this comment. To clarify, I'm talking about at a national or global leadership level. I can't speak to Michigan, of course. I can tell you that your experience there is replicated in almost every other conference, both on the theological left and right. There's no doubt that our system is broken, which is why with much regret I agree with so many others that a separation is necessary.David Livingstonhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16824538078808156089noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1632277302970738748.post-6964056660109071562021-10-08T07:37:44.273-07:002021-10-08T07:37:44.273-07:00Should read, at end of 3d line, "While only 1...Should read, at end of 3d line, "While only 1/3", not "While only 13." Sorry.theenemyhatesclarityhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15665393522436352942noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1632277302970738748.post-32889256663913415932021-10-08T07:35:11.728-07:002021-10-08T07:35:11.728-07:00You say there are no situations where progressives...You say there are no situations where progressives or centrists "take advantage of traditionalists." Let me give you one. In the Michigan Annual Conference, where I am a delegate, votes related to the issue of same sex marriage are always about 2/3 progressive, 1/3 traditionalist. While only 13 of the AC delegates are traditionalist, probably 50% of Michigan United Methodists are traditionalists, and that number, in my opinion, is possibly as high as 60-70%. Based on AC delegates it is, at a minimum 33% traditionalist. Between General Conference, Jurisdictional Conference, and alternates, Michigan has 20 delegates elected at Annual Conference. Every one of those delegates, every single one, is a progressive. There are no traditionalist delegates. Progressives TOOK ADVANTAGE of the Michigan Annual Conferences voting system to deny traditionalists any representation in the upcoming General and Jurisdictional Conferences. theenemyhatesclarityhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15665393522436352942noreply@blogger.com